“Vanity of vanities, says the Teacher, vanity of vanities! All is vanity,” says the author of Ecclesiastes.
Another way to render “vanity” is “meaningless” or “empty”. The authorship of this book has traditionally been attributed to King Solomon, the “wisest man to ever live”. This is a man who had everything. Health, riches, power, peace, good food and drink, and maybe a few too many wives. All this, and he declares that life is meaningless.
What gets you up in the morning? What, if anything gives you reason to say at the end of the day that “this has been a good day”? How can we possibly have meaning when Solomon couldn’t find it?
We Have An Intrinsic Need To Self Actualize
The term “self actualization” was coined by the organismic theorist Kurt Goldstein. “In Goldstein’s view, it is the organism’s master motive, the only real motive: ‘the tendency to actualize itself as fully as possible is the basic drive… the drive of self-actualization.'”
In other words, everyone without exception needs to have a sense of meaning. We need a lasting purpose in life.
Abraham Maslow identified five human needs, starting with our most basic of physiological needs and then continuing on to safety, then love & belonging, then esteem, and at the very top, self actualization. It is very interesting to me that the science of psychology ties together meaning with spirituality. This tells me that there is nothing in the physical realm which in and of itself can provide anyone with real or lasting meaning in life.
Personally, I think that in order for anyone to find any kind of meaning in existence, we need to start to understand the nature of God.
In the 300’s, the Cappadocian fathers were largely responsible for digging into scripture and giving us the non dualistic trinitarian theology that I believe is required for us to understand what God is all about and how we fit into this existence we’ve been thrust into. Though the modern western stream of Christianity largely believes in the basic doctrine of the trinity and gives lip-service to it, we have lost the implications of what this trinitarian God means for us.
In the 400’s Augustine of Hippo infused the dualistic philosophies of Plato and Aristotle into Christianity, and I think we need to go back to the pre-Augustine church in order to see the connection between the trinity and our life’s meaning.
There Is No Separation Between God & Man
The biggest lie heard in the western church today is that we are separated from God. This idea comes from a partial reading of Habbakuk 1:13 which says, “Your eyes are too pure to behold evil, and you cannot look on wrongdoing” (NRSV).
Really?
Does God have such a weak stomach that He cannot look upon the mess His own creation has gotten into?
I have a wife and three daughters. One of our favorite family activities over the years has been to go camping in the Rocky Mountains west of Calgary, Alberta. When we were younger and poorer we used a tent to go camping. Eventually we bought our first small camping trailer. It wasn’t much, but it had beds and a small kitchen, and like the previous tent, no washroom.
Now, campgrounds are all equipped with outhouses for folks like our younger selves who don’t have the luxury of bringing the portable washroom facilities that our older, better established selves now enjoy. As a dad with small children, there was something that always bothered me about the outhouses. The hole was just the right size for a small child to fit through. A thought that always went through my mind was, “What if one of my kids fell down there? What would I do?”
I can tell you with certainty. If one of my kids had fallen into an outhouse, I would not look away claiming that my eyes are too pure to look upon such filth. I would find a way to join my child down there in the filth to rescue her. Nothing would stop me. There would be no hesitation.
The second part of that verse from Habbakuk reads, “WHY DO YOU look upon the treacherous, and are silent when the wicked swallow those more righteous than they?” Yes, God does look upon sin. Jesus is God. God became one of us and “jumped into the outhouse” with us so to speak. Nothing can stop Him from rescuing us. Nothing.
Speaking about Jesus, Colossians 1:15-20 reads:
“15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him. 17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together. 18 He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything. 19 For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him, 20 and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.” (NASB)
It’s kind of hard to ignore verse 17. “He is before all things, and IN HIM ALL THINGS HOLD TOGETHER”. Does “all things” really mean that? Indeed, Paul previously detailed what “all things” includes: things in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, thrones, dominions, rulers, authorities—all things.
What are the implications of this? There is no separation between us and God. All are in Christ, whether they know it or not.
Relationship vs Substance
Aristotle taught us that substance was more important than relationship. One thing I really love about being alive in modern time, is how science is dispelling Neoplatonic and Aristotelian philosophies. There are discoveries constantly being made in the various disciplines of quantum physics which prove what Christendom has known for centuries. We live in exciting times!
We know that an atom, the smallest building block of substance or matter is made of three elements. Electrons, protons and neutrons. None of these things are able to form matter individually. They are held together by a relationship which we do not yet understand. Without this relationship, they cannot be held together. If they cannot be held together, there is no substance.
Therefore, Aristotle was wrong. Relationship is not only of greater importance than substance, it is the very reason substance is able to exist. I think that science will yet discover that this relationship which holds these pieces together is found in verse 17.
Like the atom, the Cappadocian fathers tell us that the Godhead is made of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Each one an individual person. All have the same substance or essence. If you take the Father by Himself, you would not have God. Same with the Son or the Holy Spirit. They only form God together, held together by relationship. We know what that relationship is. It is love.
1 John tells us repeatedly that “God is love”. It is not just another characteristic of God, otherwise John would have said, “God loves”. This is the very essence of God. What does this love look like though? How is it expressed? Is it kind of like, “I love camping, or I love my motorcycle?” Or is it something more meaningful?
The greek word for this love is “Agape” which essentially means an “other thinking, unconditional” love. It is a love that no matter what another person does to you or says to you, you accept and love them anyway. You think of them before yourself.
How is this love expressed? The concept of how love is expressed is found throughout scripture, but is best described in Philippians 2:5-7, “Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus who although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but EMPTIED HIMSELF, taking the form of a bond-servant and being made in the likeness of men.” (NASB).
The greek word for this is “Kenosis”. The Cappadocian fathers imagined this kenotic love within the trinity to be like a dance. The Father empties Himself of love into the Son, the Son empties Himself of love into the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit empties herself of love into the Father.
Some have objected to the term, “emptying”, like, “how can the Father be empty of love?” The answer to that is that He can’t. Think of the water cycle. Imagine a major river like the Mississippi, for example. It is constantly emptying itself into the ocean. It is never empty, but always in the process of emptying. The ocean likewise is always emptying into the atmosphere and the atmosphere is always emptying back into the river system. It’s like a dance.
They called it “Perichoresis”.
The Divine Dance
God created mankind and wished to include us in this dance.
The two problems were:
- We are created and God is uncreated. We cannot understand God or have a relationship with Him as such.
- We fell short by seeking independence, by choosing to have our own knowledge of good and evil over simple trust and surrender.
God solved problem #1 at the incarnation by becoming human. Jesus the Son is unique in the Godhead as He has hypostatic union in that He is forever 100% divine and also 100% human. He became the meeting place for the created and the uncreated to be together.
Problem number #2 was solved at the cross and through the resurrection. 1 Corinthians 15:20-22 says, “But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep. For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam ALL die, so also in Christ ALL will be made alive.” (NASB).
Somehow Christ took our sinful “life” from us (all humanity, not just believers) at the cross and it died with Him. With the resurrection, Christ took His life, His relationship with the Father and shared it with us. So in Christ we have a meeting place. We have one member of the Trinity who is both human and divine, who shares His life with us.
What does this have to do with our self actualization?
We need to come to grips with the reality that our meaning will never come from our jobs, our social status, how much money we have, etc. These are all things and relationships which can certainly bring satisfaction and joy, but are all in the end—temporal. We were created by One who is love, for the purpose of sharing in this love. We are to live, allowing God to fill us with His love, and we in turn are to unselfishly, thinking of others instead of ourselves, allow that very love to be emptied into the lives of those around us, only to be constantly filled again with Gods unending love.
Might I suggest that this kind of life, engaging in the dance, God’s will being done on earth as it is in heaven by us, in a way, is heaven?
Might I also suggest that those who reject God’s love, or maybe take in His love and horde it unselfishly for themselves are living in a kind of hell?
1 Corinthians 13:1-3 says, “If i speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, i have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.” (NASB).
Conclusion
Let’s bring this into our everyday lives. If I go to my job and don’t do my best work for the sake of my customer, participating in the flow of love, it is meaningless. If I remain faithful to my wife out of obligation and my own sense of moral pride, but don’t let the love of God flowing through me touch her life, it is meaningless. If I go to a restaurant enjoying top quality service, food and drink, but am rude to the servers, withholding God’s love from their lives, it too becomes meaningless.
Wherever I go, if the lives of others are not better because of my involvement in them in some way, I think that perhaps, I have fallen short of engaging in this dance of God. I love the way Francois DuToit words 1 Cor. 16:14 in the Mirror Bible, “Agape is your genesis. Loving everyone around you is what you are all about. (Our love for one another is awakened by God’s love for us.)”
How do I fix this then when I fall short? Is there a step by step program I can follow to be a better Christian?
The church has too often been guilty of telling us that we need to just obey, spend more time at church, read the Bible more, etc., in order to have a deep relationship with God. That is backwards thinking. God is not after our obedience nor our spiritual busyness. He is after relationship with us. Obedience is simply a natural byproduct of relationship.
With perfect relationship powered by kenotic love, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil has no place in our lives. We don’t desire it. We only desire the tree of life. God’s love will indeed flow into the lives of others through us.
There is only one step: surrender.
This is the gospel which Jesus taught. The gospel is not the vapid soteriological escapism which is so prevalent in the western church today. It is not about uttering magic words a.k.a. the “sinners prayer” so that we can be forgiven by a god who’s pretty ticked off with us so that we won’t be tortured forever in the afterlife.
The gospel is knowing that we are already forgiven by a God who scandalously loves us, who has already, objectively included us in the relationship of the trinity. It is about having meaning in the here and now…and also in the afterlife. Our self actualization is found in the great dance. We are meant to live as a child, in complete surrender and dependence upon our loving Abba. We are also meant to participate in spreading that love to everyone around us.
Imagine a world where everyone lives like that with perfect meaning in their lives?
That will be heaven on earth. Let’s start with the world around us!
Ryan Harbidge is the husband to one beautiful woman and a father to three gorgeous young ladies. He lives in the small town of Nanton, Alberta, Canada and owns a painting company. Ryan likes to spend his free time reading, writing, playing music, camping, hiking, riding his motorcycle, growing a large beard and most importantly, basking in the reality of God’s love. It is Ryan’s hope and dream that others will understand and experience God’s love through his writing, music and life.
Good essay with some excellent points, but I hope you understand that because “God *won’t retain* His wrath *forever*”(written in the O.T. on more than one occasion), doesn’t mean that He doesn’t execute judgments or that there is no *finite* hell past, present, and future until the last judgment of the “goats”.
the “judgement” of god is “it is good” and the justice of god is restoration.
Ronald, I had a brain fart and posted a reply to your comment to Nicole below you instead. Sorry bro!
Yes but, what is Gods wrath? It may not be what we think it is.
Joe, your are correct. “Wrath” is not what we think it is. Biblical Greek is a much richer language than English and many biblical translators have interpreted some words that can mean many things to fit their interpretive bias based on their belief in an angry, retributive god. Wrath is a good example of this. The greek rendered as “wrath” is the word transliterated as “Orge”. It simply means “strong emotion” and has the imagery of trembling or shaking from such strong emotion. Can it mean “wrath”? Yes, but it can also mean “Sad”, or “joyful”, or “love”, etc. Context is key.
I just enjoyed a time of beer and theology with a friend last weekend and he was having trouble understanding John 3:36 which says, “He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
This is a scary sounding verse until you realize that “Orge” does not mean “wrath”. This is a better translation: “If you don’t believe in the life, forgiveness and inclusion that you have in Christ, you cannot enjoy what you have, but the persistent, all pervasive love of God will remain on you forever pulling you into this reality.”
Love it.
Thank you Ronald. I believe that the western churches idea of “Hell” comes from greek philosophy and mythology, not scripture. Our visualization of hell comes from Dante, and the concept was perpetuated by men like Augustine, John Calvin, Jonathan Edwards and too many other misguided modern teachers to name. I think the Eastern Orthodox, like the early church had a correct view of “hell”. When your physical body dies, you go into the presence of God who is love. For eternity God will pour out His love on you. If you do not want this love, well, for you this will be perceived as “hell”. If you are engaged in the dance and reciprocate this love, this love will be perceived as “heaven.” Also, remember that there is nothing in scripture which tells us that it is too late to change our minds about God once our physical bodies die. There is however, much scripture pointing to postmortem repentance. Just as Love does not force us to choose Him, so Love cannot keep us from choosing Him. An excellent book on this subject is “Her Gates Will Never Be Shut” by Brad Jersak. Remember, Gods justice is not retributive, but rather, it is always restorative. That’s jus how love rolls!
“Remember, Gods justice is not retributive, but rather, it is always restorative.”
Could you cite some bible references for your above conclusion Ryan? I’ve read the bible countless times, literally, and did not arrive at the same conclusion as the above quote you meant for Ronald.
In my bible reading, I’ve found that God warned the Children of Israel not to wander away from Him or He would cause their enemies to rise up against them and remove them from their promised lands. They repeatedly did just that, and God acted just as He promised.
1 Corinthians 10 warns us that “5 But with most of them God was not well pleased, for their bodies were scattered in the wilderness. 6 Now these things became our examples, to the intent that we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted. 7 And do not become idolaters as were some of them. As it is written, “The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.”[a] 8 Nor let us commit sexual immorality, as some of them did, and in one day twenty-three thousand fell; 9 nor let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed by serpents; 10 nor complain, as some of them also complained, and were destroyed by the destroyer. 11 Now all[b] these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages have come.”
Jesus cursed the fig tree on His way into the Temple on the day He overturned the tables of the money changers, and it is understood from His answer to His disciples’ comment on the way back, about the fig tree being dried up, that speaking to the mountain, not doubting, would remove it into the sea. He spoke that of the Temple, which is in a state of ruin and has been since AD 70.
No restoration intended.
Instead, we are the Temple of the Holy Spirit. The old is done away with completely and not restored. That is what we can expect from God, as promised, because that is ‘jus the way God flows, and He is still Love.
Here’s a few verses for you:
“Learn to do good. SEEK JUSTICE BY HELPING the OPPRESSED, DEFENDING the cause of ORPHANS, and FIGHTING FOR the RIGHTS of widows”
Isaiah 1:17
“ADMINISTER JUSTICE every morning BY RESCUE THE VICTIM of robbery from the hand of his oppressor”
Jeremiah 21:12
“ADMINISTER REAL JUSTICE, AND BE COMPASSIONATE and KIND to each other”
Zachariah 7:9
“the Lord is waiting to SHOW you MERCY, and is rising up to SHOW you COMPASSION, because the LORD is a just God”
Isaiah 30:18
“HE WILL NOT CRUSH THE WEAKEST reed OR PUT OUT A flickering CANDLE. By doing this he will cause justice to be victorious.”
Matthew 12:18
“The Spirit of the Lord is on Me, because He has anointed Me to PREACH GOOD NEWS TO the POOR. He has sent Me to PROCLAIM DELIVERANCE TO the CAPTIVES and RECOVERY OF SIGHT TO the BLIND, to RELEASE THE the OPPRESSED,”
Luke 4:18
Question: According to 1 Cor. 10, who destroyed the people? God, or the serpents and the “destroyer”? Keep in mind how we previously defined sin. It is not a moral failure to be punished…though we are punished by sin. It is the results of sin itself that punishes us. Not God. If you eat nothing but Big Macs every day for your whole life and never exercise, you will become obese, sick and die young. Is it God punishing you? Nope. It’s the results of the lifestyle you have chosen which punishes you. There are many places in the Old Testament which ascribe violent retribution to God. This is because the biblical writers did not have full revalation of who God is. This is one reason why God came in the flesh as Jesus. He wanted us to know what He is really like. He is love, He is vulnerable, forgiving, non-violent, etc. Research the whole subject of “progressive revalation”. Also the incident with the fig tree, and the “cleansing of the temple” was what we call “prophetic theatre”. Too big of a subject to go into here. Brian Zahnd has some thorough teachings on this.
Are you cherry-picking scripture in order to define God your way?
I know God is merciful, just, et al, but for just one example of how He metes out justice, take a closer look at Number 12:14 for how He quickly takes care of a situation where Moses was being bad-mouthed by Miriam and Aaron – Then the Lord said to Moses, “If her father had but spit in her face, would she not be shamed seven days? Let her be shut out of the camp seven days, and afterward she may be received again.”
Is the Lord not making this leprosy judgement against her the equivalent of spitting in his daughter’s face?
Thank you Nicole. Looks like I posted my previous comment on your comment instead of Ronald’s. Oopsie!
Jim, I’m defining God by who Jesus is. He alone is perfect theology. I would like to give you some homework if you don’t mind. Study “progresssive revelation”. A good place to start is a book by Brad Jersak (who has also written for Brazen Church) called “A More Christlike God”.
Eve was offered some new insights about God too. It felt right, and she ate it. This sounds the same, Ryan. Sorry to be such a downer, but you need to re-examine your viewpoint about the infallibility of the Word. You need to realize that it would take a sorry excuse for a God not to have provided us with the Word that we can stake our lives on. Yes, like me and you, He would be in the outhouse rescuing His child, so why would He be so shoddy and downright negligent by giving us a bible we have to redact most of what’s in it in order to navigate to eternal life through faith?
Jim I love your questions and more than that, the fact that you are asking them. It’s an important thing for everyone to do that. Unfortunately most Christians, especially are scared of doing that. I would like to clarify that I do indeed believe that the Word of God is infallible and that God did give us a Word that we can stake our lives on. His name is Jesus. The Word of God is not a book. And yes, I do place HUGE value on the Bible, not to mention thorough exegetical approach to understanding it. Here’s something a friend of mine posted a couple of days ago:
GOD’S WORD NEVER CHANGES but He is not the least bit adverse to blowing up and destroying your current understanding of it..—Don Keathley
Yes, Jesus did that. In Luke 4:17-21 Jesus reads from Isaiah. Compare that reading to Isaiah 61:1,2 and note where Jesus stops and rolls up the scroll and puts it down.
Also read Matthew 5:38, 43-44. Jesus is constantly contradicting the Old Testament perception of who God is by His teaching and His orthopraxy. I don’t know about you, but I feel much better about my source for new insights about God than the source that Eve had. Keep searching my friend!
Welcome news from you regarding infalability, Ryan. Yes, the Holy Spirit constantly blows up our locked-in mind sets and then gives us the real ones in exchange while we marvel. You’re right, its not a book. I will keep searching for more gold, and I know you will as well. Cheers.
Thanks Ryan, this is a great message.
To reinforce that we still do not understand how relationships affect us, I was watching a YouTube channel talking about the effects of alcohol on behaviour. It is now evident that there are different effects when individuals are alone rather than in groups but the exact mechanism is unknown.
This is just further evidence in support of what you have shared. We were created to be in relationship with God and each other. This is the ultimate expression of the purpose God has for us.
Very interesting!…and amen brother.
Just beautiful. Thank you.
Thank you Sherrilou
What a joy to open this up on a gorgeous Sunday morning and read your words. Truth. Surrender, relationship, trust, love. The hardest things to achieve, the path is indeed narrow but by knowing we are already in God I can relax, I can recline at the table. I think that’s why the broad path is so attractive, we can all relate to hard work, judgemental attitudes, constantly trying to measure up, the big payoff, the appeal of the black and white, the I’m in your out way of thinking. This comes so easily to me because it’s the way of the world. It will be a hard slog to rid Christianity of the legacy of Aristotle. Insights like yours are desperately needed!
Thank you Veronika for your words of encouragement! You made my day.
Ephesians 2:13 “But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ. 14 For He Himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has torn down the dividing wall of hostility 15 by abolishing in His flesh the law of commandments and decrees. He did this to create in Himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace…”
‘… you who were once far away…’. ‘…and has torn down the dividing wall…’
Seems like Ephesians needs a revision as well because it talks about there being a separation between man and God.
Hi Jim – I heard Andrew Farley this afternoon – April 23/17; he was talking about this passage that you mentioned (in Ephesians) – in his answer to someone he said that the dividing wall was between Jews and Gentiles, not between God and us..I found it very helpful and an astute reading of the scripture; I hope it does you some good as well, because if Ephesians needs revision, we’re in bigger trouble than I thought!
The only ‘dividing wall’ between Jews and Gentiles, as I read it in the bible, is the wall God put in place when he commanded the Children of Israel not to intermarry with the Gentiles of the lands they conquered and occupied because if they did, they would assimilate their gods, forsake the Lord and then they themselves would be conquered and lose possession of their lands.
The dividing wall that Paul refers to is clearly brought about, as it says in Ephesians 2:14, 15, by the Law that God introduced to the Children of Israel by Moses.
Jim, I believe that Paul is referring to a relational separation. The reality is, that there is no way to relate to God while we are held captive by sin. Colossians 1:21 says, ” Once you were alienated from God and were enemies IN YOU MINDS because of your evil behaviour.”
Any separation that exists between us and God is only in our minds. Sin has been dealt with at the cross. The only thing holding us back from enjoying the reality of universal atonement is simple belief.
Ryan, you say ‘Sin has been dealt with at the cross.’ What is your take, then, on this scripture Paul writes about sin in the Book of Romans?
Romans 6:15 (AMP) What then [are we to conclude]? Shall we sin because we are not under Law, but under [God’s] grace? Certainly not! 16 Do you not know that when you continually offer yourselves to someone to do his will, you are the slaves of the one whom you obey, either [slaves] of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness (right standing with God)?
Jim, I’m glad you brought up that verse! First of all, its important to not look at sin as Augustine would…as a moral failure requiring punishment. Sin is a relational failure which leads to sickness and brokenness which requires a doctor, not a judge. Sin is “missing the mark”. The mark being: living in perfect relationship with the God-head (perichoresis). Before the cross, humanity was enslaved to sin. We had no way of living in union with God. Upon the death of Jesus, He took that sin to the grave and left it there. With the resurrection, He returned, bringing the relationship He shares with the Father. He gave us the gift of relationship which Jesus so often speaks of as “eternal life” (greek: aionios zoe) which is age transcending quality of life which comes from existing in relationship with the God-head. It’s not something that we have to wait for in “heaven”. It is a state of being that starts in the here and now and continues on into the spiritual realm. We now no longer have to fall short…and the reason we do is because we forget (or don’t believe) our true identity in Christ. Paul talks about this in Romans 7:21-25
Thanks for your reply, Ryan. Watchman Nee, author of The Spiritual Man in Three volumes covers this at length, and very well too. The struggle against sin is no struggle at all if we are in denial about it taking us captive, though. Sin has been dealt a death blow, but, sadly, it still can cause us to obey it, even if we are Christians in the truest sense of the word!
I agree that everyone is forgiven, but some folks might take that to be equivalent to having relationship with God. The two are not mutually exclusive. Besides resting and living in relationship with God, learning to trust Him more, our main job as Christians is to reconcile people back to Him (1 Cor 15 18-21), explaining that they are forgiven, that God is not mad at them, but that He is constantly pursuing them to get their attention to respond to Him. Since WE are now the intersection between God and man, as Jesus revealed as humanities true destiny, that is our life’s purpose as we live out our true identity as Sons & Daughters of the Father.
Jason you are right in saying that forgiveness does not equal relationship. The person who is forgiven still needs to return the embrace to enter relationship. I still believe that our only vocation as humans made in the image of God is to receive love from God and subsequently to pass it on to everyone around us, thus being participants in this perichorisis of the trinity. Being participants in reconciling others to God is a natural byproduct of living in the flow of Gods love. It’s not another job we have to do. It just comes as naturally as a tree producing fruit. Blessings to you as God uses you to draw others into the reality of what already is!
I like what you write and I also have considerable difficulty with it. Not so much that I disagree but that I don’t understand very well. And what bothers me about not understanding very well is that I am not dull of mind or lacking in discernment compared to the rest of the community of believers. Truth should not be accessible only to the most perceptive among us. Jesus was certainly for the common person, was he not?
Stanley, perhaps your difficulty is that you are looking through the filter of traditional teaching. Try to be open minded and don’t assume that if what you read differs from what you were taught that it is wrong.
Stanley, I think Chris is on to something here. You are right, a person does not have to be super perceptive to get this stuff. In fact I think that everyone understands this…in their hearts. This is something that my conservative evangelical friends will not like to hear, but here goes… The Holy Spirit is our teacher and has been shared with all of humanity at the resurrection of Christ. Yes, everyone objectively has the Holy Spirit in them, though not everyone is subjectively aware of that reality and cannot as such enjoy the full benefits of this life from Christ until they believe. As such, everyone has correct belief about who God is and who we are in Him…in our hearts. The problem is, that our heads are most often taught falsehoods about God and about our identity in Him. There is in most people, a large disparity between the orthodoxy of our heads and hearts. One role that I am and what I believe Brazen Church is committed to, is to help people like yourself understand with your head why your heart has been right all along. I believe that small children, before having their heads wrecked by religion have better orthodoxy than many learned theologians today. This is one reason why Jesus exhorts us to be like children. Trust your heart to lead you into understanding of your purpose in life. The more you understand that God isn’t angry or disappointed, the more you understand and experience that God really is love, the easier it is to let that love flow into your life and into the lives of others. That my friend is the meaning of life!
Great reply and answer! I too believe the Spirit is within all humanity as well. How would you even begin to use scriptures to support this though? You have the “the Spirit poured out on all flesh.” Any others?
Yes, both Joel 2:28 and Peters reference to the fulfillment Joel’s prophesy in Acts 2:17 is the clearest reference to this. Logistically you can also look to Romans 5:18 1Cor 15 and 2 Cor 5. All are made alive objectively in Christ. It is the Holy Spirit who brings life. If we do not have the Holy Spirit in us we simply cannot be alive.
I write as a lifelong ‘christian’ in a tailspin ..
I understand your post, and appreciate the points you make.
My question to you, however, is why do you believe any of this? How do you know any of it is true?
Is it because of the ‘christian’ country or society or home you were born into?
Is it because the repeated sunday school and preaching indoctrinated your mind into ‘believing’ it to be truth?
The ‘personal relationship’ with God you mention – really? You and God meet from time to time and exchange conversation, discuss life, such that God answers you and you answer God’s answers? I have personal relationships, but they’re nothing like what i experience with God.
Thing is, when you lie in your darkened bed at night and the blog is shut down, and no-one is looking in your direction, who are you, who is God, and how do you know?
It simply cannot be a matter of logic or rational-mindedness.
Why do you believe this stuff, to the point at which you would try to convince someone else in a public post?
just asking, mate .. because it matters
Owen, I can relate to what you are going through. I too am a life long Christian who was in a tailspin. All my life I have been taught certain things about God and Christianity that did not sit well with my “heart” so to speak. This is called cognitive dissonance. Perhaps this is what you are feeling. It’s been a long journey for me in recognizing the lies I have been taught all of my life, deconstructing my old paradigms and then searching out truth to rebuild on. The stuff I have written about here is certainly not what I learned in church. In fact, the leadership of my church which I grew up in, recently asked me to leave because of my theological shift. Why do I believe what I do? Let’s just say that on one hand, I don’t believe in blind faith. You need to believe something based on evidence. On the other hand, theology needs to be treated similarity to science. You cannot hold tightly to certitude and at the same time expect new discovery. You need to be skeptical as you search and yet trust in God to guide you to truth. Though I do know people who have experienced God tangibly speaking to them, I have never had such an experience. God speaks to me through thoughts that come into my head and through other people. As I have searched for and discovered deeper truths about who God is and who I am and what my purpose is, I have felt a real belonging to God. I feel more connected to Him and to others around me, realizing that we are all made to be loved. It’s a mind blowing and life changing concept when you are able to start to wrap your head around it and accept it as reality! This is a big topic worthy of more than a short response. I would like it if you would check out some podcasts which deal with this subject in great detail by one of my mentors, Dr. Steve McVey. Here is a link for you: https://plaintalk.simplecast.fm/ You will need to start with the first one. Enjoy!
If I understand correctly, since Augustine until recently, that would be about 2000 years, the “church” has had a wrong understanding of God, who He is, and the things He wants humans to know about Him.
What a small, powerless, God, unable to communicate with His most precious creation. From the beginning of man, God has always, including those 2000 years, gotten exactly the message to man He wanted to communicated. God’s written word, is in complete agreement with the Living Word Jesus Christ., and by the power of the Holy Spirit the written word becomes the living word. The written (the Bible) word and Jesus are in complete agreement and are one. To communicate with the church God gave us the written word and Jesus.
Vern, your comment tells me that you have not studied much church history and are possibly unaware that there are approximately 40000 Protestant denominations, which tells me that scriptural interpretation is not quite as “black & white” as you seem to think it is. The problem is not that God is so “small and powerless”, but that we as humans seem to prefer to make God in our own image as Augustine did. Numerous terrible Bible translations are reflective of this as the translators have overtly changed the meaning of much scripture by inserting their own interpretive bias, for example: the NIV which is in my opinion the sloppiest and most corrupt translation on the planet. By the way, Augustine’s influence did not affect the entire world of Christendom, just the Latin speaking western church. People will continue to see God wrongly as long as they stubbornly reject the fact that God is exactly like Jesus as what is written in Hebrews 1:3 and as Jesus Himself states in John 14:8. I would encourage you to read the very scholarly works of Dr. C Baxter Krueger on this subject. A couple of great books of His which I would recommend are, “The Great Dance”, and “Jesus and the Undoing of Adam”.
Actually Ryan, you have no idea what I have studied, and from a few sentences have made a judgement about me.
Sir, I am sorry if you feel I have made an unqualified judgement of you. That was not my intent. Generally a commenters questions/comments are reflective of their level of knowledge on the subject they are commenting on. You are correct in saying that I have no idea of what you have studied.
Peace.
Yes Ryan peace.
After searching “self actualization + holiness” I ended up on your page and started reading your original and interesting view on the topic I have my view on Ryan. I value Holiness far more than earthly self actualization.
I continued reading the comments going back and forth and eventually between Vern and yourself. In my spirit came up the words in scripture: “you argue and fight (about ideas). It is like dogs fighting causing injuries”. Not only to self but also to His Kingdom. What would hungry seeker of the truth think or do when 2 brothers are divided with own views? Its written: “a house divided in itself will come to a fall”
I value and appreciate both your views. Paul have said that we all are not on the same page. Some on solid food others on milk. We believers all in the presence of Holy Father just on another level. Well, both disciples in their own right brining the true gospel.
My calling: Let us respect Holy God amid human views. Let His Kingdom come here on earth as in Heaven.
Was thankful to see you both departed in peace.
Love and peace brothers,
Hannes
Thank you for your thoughtful comment. I agree. It is not helpful to argue about ideas. In fact, it is misguided to become caught up in ideological certitude when we are simply called to trust in God. I have actually known Vern for close to 40 years and consider him a friend. I think I was in a bit of a mood that day when Vern posted his comment. I don’t think he realized that I knew it was him (I can see the email addresses of the commenters). He assumed he was anonymous and I reacted poorly to the snarky tone in his comment. (We do sharply disagree on matters of theology). We have had some better conversations since then.
As time goes on, I more and more value the mystery of God and privilege that over certainty in my thinking. It’s really the only way to grow in our relationship with the Divine.
It sounds like you’re denying the existence of Hell. Oaul clearly states time and time again to “believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.” You need to confess Christ as Lord and admit you are a sinner, and in that moment you are saved and going to Heaven. If you don’t, you are going to Hell. Jesus talks about Hell more than anything else, stating that the smoke of their torment will rise forever and their work will never die. You are interweaving a sort of New Age, metaphorical meaning to Heaven and Hell when you say “it’s all about peace and love, man. All you gotta do is let it flow through you.” No. We are separated from God by sin and need reconciliation. The purpose of this life is to be reconciled through the Blood of Christ so that we can enter paradise. You said that in the afterlife, God will continue to pour out His love on you and you either accept it or you don’t. There are many things wrong with that. 1) The Bible specifically states that Hell is ETERNAL SEPARATION from God. There’s no twisting that. 2) if what you say is true, that means that our works are what saves us (we have to work to accept and reciprocate that love) rather than the Blood of Christ doing the work for us. Your views on Salvation are very peculiar and dangerous, and the scriptures warn us of peculiar doctrines. I hope you’ll reconsider heavily your theology.
Paul*
Worm* not work
You are correct. I absolutely deny and reject the man made idea of an angry God and eternal conscious torment in Hell. I won’t debate with you here, but would invite you to look outside of what you have previously been taught in church. Feel free to check out other, more recent articles I have written here at Brazen Church. Also, if you would be interested in studying some excellent academic works on Hell, check out the following books:
-“Her Gates will never be shut” by Brad Jersak
-“The inescapable love of God” by Thomas Talbots
-“Beyond an angry god” by Steve McVey
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